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 US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition

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DrummerBoyz95
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PostSubject: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Tue May 17, 2011 7:29 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Carbine

Should be pretty interesting to see what comes up as the winner.
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gentry
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Tue May 17, 2011 10:48 pm

well there already using the SCAR-L
to me i would say the ACR would be a nice choice
but nothing beats an old m4
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iliveforthis99
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Tue May 17, 2011 11:01 pm

The SCAR/MK16/17 looks to be canned for the most part. They're probably just going to waste time and money again trying to find something else to replace the M4 when there's already several very nice options already out there. H&K 416/417, ACR, SCAR, etc.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Tue May 17, 2011 11:11 pm

^exact point

Why waste resources when a perfect grouping of candidates are right there
Very Happy I myself am a 416 kinda guy Laughing similar layout for the mag release, safety, bolt catch, ect
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Tue May 17, 2011 11:21 pm

I favor the 416 over the rest as well. From my point of view it's almost exactly the same as the M4 with minor external changes. The things that set the two apart are on the inside and from what i've heard the 416 is a much nicer rifle in that regard. I don't know, it also kinda makes some sense to me to go with the 416 since troops would need less time to retrain and get use to it over a drastically different rifle.
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gentry
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Wed May 18, 2011 12:02 am

ill leave you guys with this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjMH94PuT_I
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iliveforthis99
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Wed May 18, 2011 12:20 am

Those Germans sure know how to make great weapons.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Wed May 18, 2011 1:33 am

They are also taking submissions for M4 improvements - rail kit and bolt carrier specifically. 500,000 new carbines would be used, and improved M4s would replace any existing M16s.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 1:49 am

Yup, HK416 all the way. I really like its reliability, and its familiar design may make it a bit easier to issue to soldiers currently trained on the M4/M16 families. The only major difference, I believe, is that it has the gas operating system of the G36. Heck, the Wikipedia article on the HK says it was created after a request by Delta Force! Also, I trust absolutely anything made by Heckler and Koch, as well as anything made by ze Germans for that matter.

Second choice...probably the FN SCAR, because it just looks like a good, solid weapon system. My cousin said that several hundreds of those guns were issued to his unit some two years ago (he's in the 75th Ranger Regiment, I think).
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 7:33 pm

The only thing is, the 416 isn't completely ambidextrous.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 8:27 pm

I think we should choose the AK-47.

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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 10:46 pm

yeah its cheap and reliable but accuracy is poor so i vote no
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 10:50 pm

Yeah in my honest opinion the AK is one of the worst modern AR's in the world.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 10:57 pm

Personally my vote goes to the CM901
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Thu May 19, 2011 11:41 pm

The media these days make the Kalashnikov look like its the best weapon ever made... haha as if.

In reality, obviously, the Kalash is a piece of junk. Then people start arguing that the AK has "superior reliability". You fools. What's the point of having a reliable gun if you have to expend an entire mag just to hit your target once? That argument is pretty much obsolete, considering the HK416...

EDIT: LOL, did anyone else notice the bottom-right corner of the picture Durkee posted??
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Fri May 20, 2011 11:13 am

gentry wrote:
yeah its cheap and reliable but accuracy is poor so i vote no
Completely a myth. AK accuracy is entirely comparable to that of an AR model. This misconception comes from the difficulty of controlling the weapon during sustained fully automatic fire, solely due to the larger round. Do you ever handle a F/A weapon system thinking it'll be "accurate"? On semi, it's just as good, if not better, than any AR system. Given that FA small arms are rarely even used anymore...\"Watch your language\", there was something a few years ago going through congress asking to have the FA function removed from M4's because soldiers/Marines didn't see it as useful...that shouldn't even be an argument.

You've all just been conditioned to think that the AK is sub-par because it's a "terrorist/communist rifle".
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Fri May 20, 2011 7:29 pm

Spl. Durkee wrote:
gentry wrote:
yeah its cheap and reliable but accuracy is poor so i vote no
Completely a myth. AK accuracy is entirely comparable to that of an AR model. This misconception comes from the difficulty of controlling the weapon during sustained fully automatic fire, solely due to the larger round. Do you ever handle a F/A weapon system thinking it'll be "accurate"? On semi, it's just as good, if not better, than any AR system. Given that FA small arms are rarely even used anymore...\"Watch your language\", there was something a few years ago going through congress asking to have the FA function removed from M4's because soldiers/Marines didn't see it as useful...that shouldn't even be an argument.

You've all just been conditioned to think that the AK is sub-par because it's a "terrorist/communist rifle".

Well, its not just the accuracy that I have problems with, although you make a good point.
For starters, the Kalahnikov is nearly 70 years old...kind of outdated, don't you think? That being said, the rifle is not very shooter-friendly, and is not very ergonomical compared to modern-rifles. The notched sights are very primitive, too.

Also, one reason the US Army switched to the smaller 5.56mm round is because of how light it was. While I would agree that the AK was superior to the early M16 varients, they just don't live up to our more modern assault rifles.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Fri May 20, 2011 8:13 pm

I really like the AK but when you really look at the overall design it's kinda awful. Full auto shouldn't be removed, it shouldn't even be considered. Sure it's not used all the time but it sure is nice to have on a gun if you need the extra firepower it can give. Besides i'm pretty sure there's a selector switch on most AR's that can be used to fire semi only or full-auto. It's not like you're forced to use something you don't have to use all the time.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Fri May 20, 2011 8:42 pm

If they don't see the full auto function as useful.... well then don't use it. Simple enough.
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Fri May 20, 2011 11:47 pm

AllTheGoodNamesWereTaken wrote:
Spl. Durkee wrote:
gentry wrote:
yeah its cheap and reliable but accuracy is poor so i vote no
Completely a myth. AK accuracy is entirely comparable to that of an AR model. This misconception comes from the difficulty of controlling the weapon during sustained fully automatic fire, solely due to the larger round. Do you ever handle a F/A weapon system thinking it'll be "accurate"? On semi, it's just as good, if not better, than any AR system. Given that FA small arms are rarely even used anymore...\"Watch your language\", there was something a few years ago going through congress asking to have the FA function removed from M4's because soldiers/Marines didn't see it as useful...that shouldn't even be an argument.

You've all just been conditioned to think that the AK is sub-par because it's a "terrorist/communist rifle".

Well, its not just the accuracy that I have problems with, although you make a good point.
For starters, the Kalahnikov is nearly 70 years old...kind of outdated, don't you think? That being said, the rifle is not very shooter-friendly, and is not very ergonomical compared to modern-rifles. The notched sights are very primitive, too.

Also, one reason the US Army switched to the smaller 5.56mm round is because of how light it was. While I would agree that the AK was superior to the early M16 varients, they just don't live up to our more modern assault rifles.

That's where the AK-105 comes in Very Happy This model doesn't even have the accuracy problem on full auto Very Happy
The only 74's I've ever shot had ghost ring sights, and I would honestly choose the 74's 5.45 round any day.

Yeah, that's a little kid firing it...and keeping it squared on full auto Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Sat May 21, 2011 12:15 am

I have that shirt...
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Sat May 21, 2011 1:39 am

Yeah, the latest assault rifles to come out of Russia really look promising...and those 5.45 "poison bullet" rounds are just bad-ass. There are probably several videos on youtube showing how those suckers tumble around in the targets flesh and it looks...painful, to say the least.

On a similar note; who thinks we should adopt a bull-pup design?? I know that has primarily been a European thing, but I just fired QBZ-95 last week and that thing was extremely comfortable and easy to use...
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Sat May 21, 2011 4:45 am

Im all for the the Bushmaster ACR not because of stupid CoD but it has all the requirements, rails, fully ambidextrous, multicaliber, ergonomic, and most of all MADE IN THE USA!! (I think?)
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Sat May 21, 2011 8:05 am

The HQ of Bushmaster is about an hour car ride from my house. I know at one point they made firearms there, but I'm unsure if they still do. Im fairly certain they do.

I didnt notice, but did anyone bring up the M4 chambered 6.8 SPC?
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PostSubject: Re: US Army to conduct M4 replacement competition   Sat May 21, 2011 8:10 am

Probably not because that'd never happen. Not unless all of NATO switches to the 6.8 SPC round.
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