This is going to be fun

Okay you guys, this section is dedicated to the AEG out there that is most underrated and unspoken of, the UMG/UMP. (Universal Machine Pistole (German)) I'm wondering what some of the best makers and models of this gun are, and Just want to discuss different aspects of the gun. I know G&G make one that looks sick, But I don't know anything about it other than that. I also know TM, STAR, and TSD make one. I'll kick this thread off by sharing my knowledge of THAT particular AEG.

TSD:
The TSD SD45, or the TSD UMP is an EXACT copy of the Double Eagle version. It still even has the Double Eagle trades on the side!!! and it also has "M87" on it, which is DE's designation for the weapon. The sites need to be adjusted with little hex screws that come with it, a downer to me, not very convenient. In the box you get a cleaning rod, a cheap-o sling, two magazines, a battery, charger, and the site adjusting tools. The whole gun IS plastic, but it is a higher grade plastic. Metal parts include the Hop-Up, selector switch, the internal piece of the bolt, the front sling mount, and the rails. A big downside is the battery and the battery housing. The TSD instructions state that it comes with a 9.6v battery but it indeed comes with an 8.4....a 9.6 would never fit anyway, the 8.4v hardly does. It takes a lot of time and frustration to get the battery in, and a lot of cramming is involved and the wires are bent so badly when the battery is in that it looks like they're being destroyerd. The housing itself is located in the back where the stock folds, so the stock must be folded to get in. Speaking of the stock, It is actually pretty High Quality and when folded snaps into place very nicely. Its very solid and has a nice cheek rest, which can be removed. The selector switch is an ambidextorous MP5 switch which I've heard can be a little iffy. The hop-up is located on the right side of the gun and can be revealed by pulling back the bolt; inside you will find the Hop-Up adjustmeant. It's easy to adjust, but I hear its super sensitive so you'll need to make very minor adjustments. Another downside to the gun is the charging handle, which dances and jiggles around quite freely. The gun comes with four rails, one on all sides of the gun. The mags hold about 300 rds, and are pretty long so they wont fit into your standard M4 pouch well. They feed well until the last 25 rds, the spring just has issues and can't load them. I heard they can use G&G mags but cannot confirm that.
The gun Chronos around 350 FPS and I hear the range is actually surprising.

The build would get a 7/10 for me. I've heard the plastic is great quality and the body looks great, but the battery housing is AWFUL and the fact that it is plastic is a downer.
The looks will get an 8/10 for me. I LOVE the look of the UMP, but the TSD looks so plasticy, and they still have Double Eagle trades on their gun. Thats so wrong in many ways, and even more theres a lame warning on there about the user not being under 18.
Performance......Can't really give you an accurate look at this but I'll throw out a 7/10. ROF is just average 350 FPS isn't bad, and while the gun is definately meant for CQB it could possibly compete at field ranges.

That's it...whew. I would say the TSD version (Or double eagle version I guess) could be worth a buy, but I probably wouldn't buy it from them.

Thanks to CARP at CQB radio for the info on the TSD UMP....

G&G
EDIT: I just found this on AEX. It reviews the G&G UMP. and I have to say I'm not too pleased...this will have to be a fix 'em up gun, which actually sounds like a fun project for me.
http://www.airsoftextreme.com/store/index.php?main_page=infopages&pages_id=23

Here are the things that stood out to me in the AEX review:
The RPM was extremely unnerving at 500-600 RPM. Even worse, The only path I see available is a better motor, because the battery housing is so small on the UMPs both reviews of stated it is not wise (If even possible) to put anything in besides a 8.4v battery....
Velocity was also low at 260-280 Feet Per Second. This would take even more internal work than just a new spring.
The outside of the gun however was very sexy, with some nice trades & stamps, a metal dust cover nicely engraved with "6mm Auto" which will replace ".45 Auto", which can be cocked AND LOCKED back with the charging handle and functional bolt catch.
Another nice feature is the rear sight which can switch from standard rear sight to the flip-up ghost ring.
The G&G Magazines look very high quality which Isn't surprising, and come with a nice capacity of 530 rds.
Dissasembly doesn't look too complicated.

IMHO, I am not believing the words that are coming out of my mouth, but....the "Double-Eagle in disguise" might be a better deal than this G&G....The G&G without a doubt has better externals, but the TSD has better performance. Not better internals neccesarily, but better performance. I'm hoping with some work It would be possible to turn the G&G into a real combat machine (Not the company ) If thats the case, then of course I'd go with the G&G.

Still no Info on the STAR, TM, or any others I don't know of out there....some help would be nice guys, on those or anything else I missed on the two I've talked about... lets get this ball rollin!!

how long have you been compiling all this info, M14?!!!
thanks, though, it was a very informational article. thumbs up!

about two days
Thanks for the input!

you are very welcome, fellow airsofter!

M14 double-taps wrote:

Okay you guys, this section is dedicated to the AEG out there that is most underrated and unspoken of, the UMG/UMP. (Universal Machine Pistole (German)) I'm wondering what some of the best makers and models of this gun are, and Just want to discuss different aspects of the gun. I know G&G make one that looks sick, But I don't know anything about it other than that. I also know TM, STAR, and TSD make one. I'll kick this thread off by sharing my knowledge of THAT particular AEG.

TSD:
The TSD SD45, or the TSD UMP is an EXACT copy of the Double Eagle version. It still even has the Double Eagle trades on the side!!! and it also has "M87" on it, which is DE's designation for the weapon. The sites need to be adjusted with little hex screws that come with it, a downer to me, not very convenient. In the box you get a cleaning rod, a cheap-o sling, two magazines, a battery, charger, and the site adjusting tools. The whole gun IS plastic, but it is a higher grade plastic. Metal parts include the Hop-Up, selector switch, the internal piece of the bolt, the front sling mount, and the rails. A big downside is the battery and the battery housing. The TSD instructions state that it comes with a 9.6v battery but it indeed comes with an 8.4....a 9.6 would never fit anyway, the 8.4v hardly does. It takes a lot of time and frustration to get the battery in, and a lot of cramming is involved and the wires are bent so badly when the battery is in that it looks like they're being destroyerd. The housing itself is located in the back where the stock folds, so the stock must be folded to get in. Speaking of the stock, It is actually pretty High Quality and when folded snaps into place very nicely. Its very solid and has a nice cheek rest, which can be removed. The selector switch is an ambidextorous MP5 switch which I've heard can be a little iffy. The hop-up is located on the right side of the gun and can be revealed by pulling back the bolt; inside you will find the Hop-Up adjustmeant. It's easy to adjust, but I hear its super sensitive so you'll need to make very minor adjustments. Another downside to the gun is the charging handle, which dances and jiggles around quite freely. The gun comes with four rails, one on all sides of the gun. The mags hold about 300 rds, and are pretty long so they wont fit into your standard M4 pouch well. They feed well until the last 25 rds, the spring just has issues and can't load them. I heard they can use G&G mags but cannot confirm that.
The gun Chronos around 350 FPS and I hear the range is actually surprising.

The build would get a 7/10 for me. I've heard the plastic is great quality and the body looks great, but the battery housing is AWFUL and the fact that it is plastic is a downer.
The looks will get an 8/10 for me. I LOVE the look of the UMP, but the TSD looks so plasticy, and they still have Double Eagle trades on their gun. Thats so wrong in many ways, and even more theres a lame warning on there about the user not being under 18.
Performance......Can't really give you an accurate look at this but I'll throw out a 7/10. ROF is just average 350 FPS isn't bad, and while the gun is definately meant for CQB it could possibly compete at field ranges.

That's it...whew. I would say the TSD version (Or double eagle version I guess) could be worth a buy, but I probably wouldn't buy it from them.

Thanks to CARP at CQB radio for the info on the TSD UMP....

G&G
EDIT: I just found this on AEX. It reviews the G&G UMP. and I have to say I'm not too pleased...this will have to be a fix 'em up gun, which actually sounds like a fun project for me.
http://www.airsoftextreme.com/store/index.php?main_page=infopages&pages_id=23

Here are the things that stood out to me in the AEX review:
The RPM was extremely unnerving at 500-600 RPM. Even worse, The only path I see available is a better motor, because the battery housing is so small on the UMPs both reviews of stated it is not wise (If even possible) to put anything in besides a 8.4v battery....
Velocity was also low at 260-280 Feet Per Second. This would take even more internal work than just a new spring.
The outside of the gun however was very sexy, with some nice trades & stamps, a metal dust cover nicely engraved with "6mm Auto" which will replace ".45 Auto", which can be cocked AND LOCKED back with the charging handle and functional bolt catch.
Another nice feature is the rear sight which can switch from standard rear sight to the flip-up ghost ring.
The G&G Magazines look very high quality which Isn't surprising, and come with a nice capacity of 530 rds.
Dissasembly doesn't look too complicated.

IMHO, I am not believing the words that are coming out of my mouth, but....the "Double-Eagle in disguise" might be a better deal than this G&G....The G&G without a doubt has better externals, but the TSD has better performance. Not better internals neccesarily, but better performance. I'm hoping with some work It would be possible to turn the G&G into a real combat machine (Not the company ) If thats the case, then of course I'd go with the G&G.

Still no Info on the STAR, TM, or any others I don't know of out there....some help would be nice guys, on those or anything else I missed on the two I've talked about... lets get this ball rollin!!

ya, i was gonna say, carp did a whole report in episode 4 on the TSD ump .45. it sounds ok buy umps aren't my style.

JARHEAD wrote:

ya, i was gonna say, carp did a whole report in episode 4 on the TSD ump .45. it sounds ok buy umps aren't my style.

No way the Tsd seemed DECENT and only that, but the fact that the gun IS the DE version EXACTLEY just made them lose my sale. I mean it's still get their trades on it for Don't use the Lord's name in vain.'s sake!!

M14 double-taps wrote:

JARHEAD wrote:

ya, i was gonna say, carp did a whole report in episode 4 on the TSD ump .45. it sounds ok buy umps aren't my style.

No way the Tsd seemed DECENT and only that, but the fact that the gun IS the DE version EXACTLEY just made them lose my sale. I mean it's still get their trades on it for Don't use the Lord's name in vain.'s sake!!

yeah, i mean, TSD could do so much better than that.

Any Company should have the decency to do so. IMHO.