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 Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)

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SNIPER ELITE
Lone Wolf
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Jarhead999 76 65
Satan
Spl. Durkee
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:17 pm

As many of you know I recently joined the Civil Air Patrol, a civilian-manned auxillary of the United States Air Force.

CAP performs three congressionally assigned missions:
-Emergency services, which includes search and rescue (by air and ground)
-Disaster relief operations
-Aerospace education for youth and the general public

A few months ago I ceased production on my most technical project due to time/money restraints.
That project was an unmanned aerial vehicle used for reconnaissance on the airsoft field.

Heres the situation.

Since learning about search techniques used by CAP in field-rescue, I have gotten inspiration to continue the project...but with enhanced emphasis on search/rescue capabilities. The CAP rescue/search system utilized NO UAVs...costing hundreds of dollars per-sortie to have search aircraft in the air. Im looking to help develop a low-cost alternative.

I have an idea of which production RC airframe to start with, but maybe someone can help me.

So far my basic needs are:
-Foam body
-Must be slow-fly capable
-Must be able to carry a 1/2 lbs payload with stock motor (camera, radio equip, etc)
-Less than $200
-Must have optional additional channel (to equip/fire smoke-markers)

This project will be funded by the US Air Force.

Any input would be greatly appreciated. I will be starting on the 1st of January, 2010.


Last edited by Spl. Durkee on Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Satan
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:21 pm

Hey man thats amazing stuff hope to hear more.
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Jarhead999 76 65
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:22 pm

I think I've seen a remote control plane modeled after a B52 that could work. Just suggesting it.
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:29 pm

Thank you very much.

It's my way of giving back to those who protect us on a daily basis.

Many people don't know but during WWII German U-boats were as close as 50 miles off our coast. The Civil Air Patrol was forned and tasked with locating and destroying these subs. Since then, CAP has grown to become a task force utilized by law enforcement, border patrol, and military... and are known for our search and rescue capabilities worldwide.

On August 20th, 2007 a CAP aircraft went down while searching for a missing child. All three crew members were killed. Those kinds of deaths should never happen. Unmanned systems could be implemented in high-risk sorties instead of putting live pilots into the air.
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:30 pm

Jarhead999 76 65 wrote:
I think I've seen a remote control plane modeled after a B52 that could work. Just suggesting it.

I'm hoping to not use a scale model. Rather, something that is purpose built. B-52 RC planes are naturally unstable and prone to difficulties because they have multiple props/engines.
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Jarhead999 76 65
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:32 pm

Have you gone to your local RC shop to see what they have? Look for something that uses a ducted fan or duct fan or something that sounds similar.

Also, are you looking into the possibility of a rotary-wing RC aircraft?


Last edited by Jarhead999 76 65 on Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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white wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 8:32 pm

do they take pilots with CODA(certificate of demenstrated ability?)

and whatever you do, the airframe for the firebird(look it up) is stable, but you would need to re work the servos
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 9:16 pm

@Jarhead: Nope, rotary will not work due to instabilities and the need for overall simplicity, not to mention that the typical RC heli has low range and lift capability.

I looked at ducted fans for a while, but they provide way too much thrust for the type of work this craft will be performing. The UAERSV will be performing slow-flight crash surveying.

@White Wolf: Yes, the Civil Air Patrol is completely volunteer, and take everyone as long as you can prove physical wellness.

Ya the Firebird is what I was looking at. I'd have to rewire, put new servos, and probably enlargen the wings for added lift/payload. If I can't get any better options I may just do that.
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 9:23 pm

and the problem comming from hawks experience is the dud motor where it just is to few RPMs to propell the craft
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 11:53 pm

Well if your into using UAV's, certainly anything that can recognized heat patterns of 98.6 F on the ground. You may want to get into RC airplanes and helicopters. Of course with your added knowledge of flying you learned in CAP will help you in the basics, and like airsoft eventually build your own model plane that you can send up with a FLIR camera attached to the belly.

Now you said prop would be too unstable for your uses. However would a helicopter platform be stable enough. More complex but it would be a lot more like the ground unit UAV's we've seen in Ghost Recon or MW2.
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Jarhead999 76 65
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeThu Nov 19, 2009 11:59 pm

Lone Wolf wrote:
However would a helicopter platform be stable enough.

That's what rotary wing is.
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 12:02 am

Sorry I thought you meant a simple prop airplane, not helicopter.
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Jarhead999 76 65
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 12:26 am

no worries, mistakes happen! Smile
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 1:16 am

Ya I have 4 years experience in flying and building RC aircraft. Im just coming here with the question because Im trying to find a design to build off of. Ive seen some recent stuff on law enforcement light UAVs and I'll likely be building off a similar design. As I said, I'll probably go pick up a Firescout Commander XL and boost the power on the engine and increase the wing area (flaps). Theoretically, a stock model has the lift capability I need...but I don't want to go stock Very Happy
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white wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 5:30 pm

and with the stick going to the tail, might you reinforce that as a mus.... and flaps, are they going to be adjustable or based on the air tractors?
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 8:39 pm

No the flaps will be fixed. It takes too much weight to include servos for dynamics.

I wil probably leave the tail boom as is, considering it is extremely durable.
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white wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 8:51 pm

yeah, so what about the extra equipment, where's that all?
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SNIPER ELITE
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 8:54 pm

hey wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 10:42 pm

elite, just an FYI, on the posts here we don't say hey to someone, you make a post that adds input to the topic, there is private messaging for the private convos. but anyway Durkee this sounds awesom. if your interested i have a VERY small camera, it isn't bigger than 2 suggar cubes combined into a square and the actual lense it about the size of a pen tip. it may b useful. a hefty $100 but well worth it. you may need to add extra radios/ you WILL/ to make sure it feeds back to you but if youd like i can find the info for it, name and company.

somewhat similiar to the size of the one on this HO scale model train, that entire car is about 4-6 inches long. http://www.coffeetabletrains.com/TrainCam6.jpg
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 10:52 pm

Wowowow this sounds amazing. I can't really contribute though, I know nothing about this particular subject....All I can say is VIEL GLUCK! (good luck)
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Jarhead999 76 65
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeFri Nov 20, 2009 11:40 pm

JARHEAD wrote:
elite, just an FYI, on the posts here we don't say hey to someone, you make a post that adds input to the topic, there is private messaging for the private convos.

THERE'S A NEW POST NAZI! EVERYBODY RUN!!! (drops laptop, grabs Marine Colors, and runs)

sorry, had to say it. I'll be back on topic now.
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeSat Nov 21, 2009 12:04 am

Jarhead999 76 65 wrote:
JARHEAD wrote:
elite, just an FYI, on the posts here we don't say hey to someone, you make a post that adds input to the topic, there is private messaging for the private convos.

THERE'S A NEW POST NAZI! EVERYBODY RUN!!! (drops laptop, grabs Marine Colors, and runs)

sorry, had to say it. I'll be back on topic now.

lol, but i mean, hey wolf? i have the right!!! lol
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white wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeSat Nov 21, 2009 12:09 am

yeah you do, I also meantioned it to em from a PM i sent
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Spl. Durkee
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeWed Dec 23, 2009 8:45 pm

So I found a system I may want to start with... http://www.raidentech.com/24ghzmiwicoc.html

I know its not one of the more "high end" HPV systems out there, but I just need something simple just as a "proof of concept"...and I hear this is one of the best out there for under $200. The only thing I'm really worried about is the fact that I would have to use an on-board 12v battery to power the camera...and I don't know how much weight that would be and how much that would effect flight characteristics. But hey, if it weighs to much I'll just throw it on a land system.
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white wolf
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PostSubject: Re: Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol)   Unmanned Airborne Search/Rescue Platform (Civil Air Patrol) Icon_minitimeWed Dec 23, 2009 9:13 pm

and keeping the CG center too
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