Question involving drop compensation

Yeah , I do that as well , anyway as for bb's I shoot 0.28's due to acurracy being key to a sniper , bet you didn't see that one coming eh , sticks .

as bad as it sounds i just turned around and pulled my hood up. he shot me in the back so i wasn't really worried about getting hit in the eye.

Drop compensation...

Basically, you should be able to tell after a while when a target is within your range. Fire at it, then your spotter can tell you where your bb hit, so you can then adjust your SCOPE (not just aiming above, but actually adjusting your scope) to compensate. That way, you're always aiming at the centre of your crosshairs, and you can just adjust your scope till you're getting it dead centre at that range. (unless it's out of range then there's no point in shooting, just wasting ammo)

Compensating for wind however, is a little different. Don't aim to the left/right of your target, but pivot the gun in your shoulder (twist it) so that the hop-up compensates for the wind. find the right amount of twist for the wind speed (this is where airsoft is easier than real life, because as the wind speed changes you just twist the gun more or less accordingly)

Hope that helped.

Jim

And about bb's:

I would personally never use anything lower than .28s in a bolt action rifle. I use Digicon Straight .36s in mine (480fps, soon to be upgrading further)

Jim

I use 25s for far range , and 28s for close .

I usually use .25's but when I'm out of those I use .20's.

It all has to do with distance and angle. If you were on a cliff and someone was below you 90 degrees you obviously wouldnt have to aim anywhere but on them. If, however, the hill you were on is at a 20 degree angle and the person was at the bottom, oh say, 50 feet away then you would have to make a slight adjustment. If I were you I would go to an open field and set up targets 20 feet, 50 feet, and 100 feet away and fire as you would normally on all three of them. Check how many mils you have to aim above each of them and then factor out the feet based on your scope table. Let's imagine that for the 20 foot target you need to aim 2 inches high. For the 50 you must aim 1 foot high and for the 100 you need to aim 2 feet high. (this would not necessarily be correct as it would depend on a number of factors such as fps and BB density). Now lets put you on a hill with a target 100 feet away. due to the elevation difference of the hill you need to aim slightly higher. I always visit the field I will play on beforehand and check sniping positions on hill and degrees of difference to possible targets. For every degree to the target you must add 1/8 of an inch to your drop estimation. So if you have a 20 degree difference to a target 100 feet away (with the calculations measured earlier) you would need to aim 26 and 6/8 inches higher to hit the target. Factor this out on you mil dot chart to get the approx. height difference. If you were at a 60 degree angle and a target was 50 feet away you would need to aim 19.5 inches above the target to hit it. What I would reccomend to you is to set up the 0 degree angle drop test to see what your drop is for a given range and then try to guage the distance to a target on the battlefield and the angle to them and then just estimate on the field. Good luck with that. Now if you are shooting up at a target then you make a 1/4 inch difference for every angle upwards you must shoot.( a target 20 feet away on a 40 degree angle above you would mean you need to aim 12 inches high to hit the target) once again factor it out before the game starts.

wow nice job but i have a easyer solution take a shot see where it goes then compinsate if you know yur rifle this should only take two shots then you have that area scoped and you don't have to worry to much about where to aim.

The only bad thing about that killyouno5 is that you may never know who is watching and if they know where you are.

Tasada

trytosplitupyourtextsoitsnotjustonesolidblockbecausethatmakesitreallybloodydifficulttoread

Jim

Can do buddy, asIwasgoingtosay,

If you want to use the shoot, have your spotter tell you where it goes, and shoot again method go ahead. I prefer not to tip the enemy off because I have been shot at by the same gun and you can hear the BB in the air.

Plus in the real world you only get one shot.

I think .25 is the lowest you should use, the heavier the bb the less FPS but the better the accuracy. .25 is right in the middle, .20s are to light but are good for ad least 80-100 ft with no wind and give you the FPS it says. but you might not want .2s you might want to go with .25... but thats only from what im told and from what I've watched and researched. So if your gun shoots 400 FPS out of the box.... then it may only shoot about 350-370 FPS with .25, now if you can get a spring and TB upgrade which lets just say bumps your FPS up to.... idk like 560 ( based off my new setup for the L-96 with a Tritnum spring and a TB)* I know they are completely different guns* then by all means use .28s or stay with .25s, you just don't want to cheat yourself FPS for a greater accuracy which will only be effect at like what 120-140 ft with like.. hmmm 400-75 will give you 325 FPS which I think isen't worth it. Im not 100% sure, iv only been playing airsoft for 3-4 months as a AEGer and just starting as sniping but from what I gather and what im told this will most likely be your outcome. I know im no expert on the matter but I wanted to get a word in to see if iv grasped the whole BB to FPS accuracy ratio lol

Actually that post is pretty accurate , ecept for the part about the fps with those bbs .

idk, I thought i was pretty close... but my post is kind of confusing lol

Tasada- In airsoft sniping, you will rarely get one-shot kills. Anyone that claims to get them consistently is a liar because there are so many inconsistencies in the sport: bb's, wind, speed of target, size of target, distance of target, unpredictability of target movement etc etc.

Jim

I'm not saying I get them consistantly. I'm saying that even in the unpredictable sport of airsoft I can get a good idea of where my BB is going to go most of the time. Oh and BTW that post on angle compensation of mine is based on testing with my gun.

Yeah you can compensate by aiming above if you have multiple targets at differing ranges- but otherwise it's better to centre your crosshair where your bb is hitting.

Of course you have a good idea of where your BB is going to hit- but rarely good enough for a one-hit kill because you don't know EXACTLY where your bb is going to go with regard to distance and windage until after you've fired a shot- at which point you have to make an adjustment.

Jim

guys i think this one is shot to the ground... This could get ugly if it doest stop lol not trying to control you guys but just remember everyone has different skills and different guns and each gun is different so the best thing you can do is learn your gun as best as you can.

Huh?

It just seemed like if it kept going the way it was it could turn into an argument between some of the members and i don't want to have to see a couple of guys going at it lol.

About 70% of the time I know EXACTLY where my BB is going to go. I've been firing real steel since I was 7. I can make a 700 yard shot with my R700. I can apply everything I know about shooting to airsoft. I've fired my sniper rifle a lot so I know how the BB flies.

Now don't take me out of context. I know EXACTLY where my BB is going to go. That doesn't mean that 70% of my shots are kills. You can never tell when a gust of wind is going to pick up and throw your BB off at the worst possible time. You never know when your BB is going to fly over a hotspot and rise just a bit too high. You never know when your hop-up is just going to completely throw your BB off to the side. I know EXACTLY where the BB should go, but it doesn't always just because of these variables.

If I was in a room with normal temperature and no open windows I would be able to hit the target 70% of the time.

The other 30% is just the random inconsistancies in the BBs and the barrel.

I know what I'm talking about.

Now I'm going to say this one more time. If you want to use the fire, have your spotter tell you where the BB goes, and fire again method, I have no problem with it. I prefer to take my shots mathematically. It works for me and it's more in tune with what real snipers must use to make their shots. And if you don't mind my saying, You feel a much better sense of accomplishment when you make that one-shot kill.

In the real world you only get one shot.

Tasada wrote:

About 70% of the time I know EXACTLY where my BB is going to go. I've been firing real steel since I was 7. I can make a 700 yard shot with my R700. I can apply everything I know about shooting to airsoft. I've fired my sniper rifle a lot so I know how the BB flies.

Firstly, bragging- not cool

Quote :

Now don't take me out of context. I know EXACTLY where my BB is going to go. That doesn't mean that 70% of my shots are kills. You can never tell when a gust of wind is going to pick up and throw your BB off at the worst possible time. You never know when your BB is going to fly over a hotspot and rise just a bit too high. You never know when your hop-up is just going to completely throw your BB off to the side. I know EXACTLY where the BB should go, but it doesn't always just because of these variables.

I don't know what kind of point you are trying to make with this since it's pretty much exactly what I said, I'm not disagreeing with you at all!

Quote :

If I was in a room with normal temperature and no open windows I would be able to hit the target 70% of the time.

Irrelevant- this is not a situation that you will encounter in airsoft.

Quote :

Now I'm going to say this one more time. If you want to use the fire, have your spotter tell you where the BB goes, and fire again method, I have no problem with it. I prefer to take my shots mathematically. It works for me and it's more in tune with what real snipers must use to make their shots. And if you don't mind my saying, You feel a much better sense of accomplishment when you make that one-shot kill.

In the real world you only get one shot.

OK firstly, the technique I described is really one of the only techniques that works for airsoft. Feel free to take a long time calculating each shot, but without knowing the exact distance, and knowing what your drop will be AT that distance, there is always a degree of estimation is airsoft- so you cannot say you know EXACTLY where your shot will go, especially taking into account the wind as well. You seem to have the bizarre idea that my technique involves firing randomly at the enemy and relying soley on my spotter to tell me where to aim next. This is not the case, the fact is that if you miss, your spotter can tell you WHERE you missed, and you can adjust accordingly.

To add to your constant pressing about what real snipers do, real sniping in terms of the shooting itself (not the fieldcraft/mindset) is largely irrelevant in airsoft as the propulsion techniques, distances of engagement, ammo size, weight and power etc etc etc are all totally different.

You can only be confident to make a one shot kill in open ground, within range of the bb's straight flight path, with little or no wind, after that, so many things come into account that your one shot hit probability decreases with every variable you add:
-Range
-Windage
-Size of available target
-Foliage
etc

So what I'm saying is, even though you will have a very good idea of where your shot will go, you will not hit the exact same spot with any two shots, because there are so many variables, and IF you do miss, then your spotter is there to tell you where your bb went, and you can then adjust. I don't know why you are trying to turn this into an argument, or being patronising/condescending towards me because I am just explaining from my extensive experience in airsoft sniping what the most effective methods of hitting your target are.

Jim

Captain Quizno wrote:

use .28s or stay with .25s, you just don't want to cheat yourself FPS for a greater accuracy which will only be effect at like what 120-140 ft with like.. hmmm 400-75 will give you 325 FPS which I think isen't worth it. Im not 100% sure, iv only been playing airsoft for 3-4 months as a AEGer and just starting as sniping but from what I gather and what im told this will most likely be your outcome. I know im no expert on the matter but I wanted to get a word in to see if iv grasped the whole BB to FPS accuracy ratio lol

This is where you are incorrect- the FPS sacrifice is one I gladly use since it does not affect your range until you start getting over .36g (you will start noticing quite a lot with .43g)

The heavier the bb you use, the more steady it will be, and the more velocity it will retain in flight, so the greater the distance you will get, as well as accuracy. The only sacrifice you make is the initial FPS- which only affects the distance it will take to reach the target. Of course, this only works up to a certain point. But to explain in terms of physics:

Ek = 1/2mv^2

(kinetic energy is equal to half times mass times initial velocity squared)

And we can presume that for every 0.05g added, you will see a reduction is muzzle velocity of around 35, and we take the velocity of our hypothetical rifle to be 500fps with a .2g bb, we see that:

Ek = 1/2mv^2

Ek = 1/2 x 0.2 x 500fps^2

Ek = 2.5kJ


Ek = 1/2 x 0.36 x 388^2

Ek = 2.709792kJ

Therefore with a higher mass bb, we see an increase in overall power, and therefore distance, and we know that more weight = more accuracy, it's win win.

Until we get to .43, where it drops, as we see with:

Ek = 1/2 x 0.43 x 339^2

Ek = 2.4708015kJ

So the trend shows that up to a certain point, the heavier the bb you use, the more overall power, and therefore range you will get, as well as accuracy, so don't be fooled by the lower initial muzzle velocity.

Of course, since the actual calculations rely on metres per second instead of feet per second, the readings are innacurate (a 500fps rifle is more lik 1.8kJ, not 2.5 as stated above) but still show the actual trend, and I have only used fps so you can understand what I'm talking about, because if I start throwing in figures for metres per second, it'll most likely cause confusion.

Jim

Great math Jim, I was going to combine the posts but i think they are well worth a seperate post.

If any of you guys didnt get that Basically what happens is the greater the BB weight the more consistent the FPS(velocity). When Jim states initial velocity he means the chrono rating which is the peak of you velocity. Per say you are shooting a clone L96(450FPS for sake of analogy), when you use lighter BB's(.2) you chrono readings are going to be 450ish. However when you use heavier BB's(.3) your chrono readings are going to be 385ish. Automatically you think this is stupid because you shots are going to go a shorter distance. When you shoot long distances you FPS readings go down, so at per say 200ft you .2G BB is just about done(130-200FPS), however your .3G BB is still in the OK area because it caries more inertia(220-280FPS). The reason a .2G BB looks like it goes farther is because it is going at a greater velocity, your .3G BB looks like its going a shorter distance because it is going a slower but more consistent FPS.

To simplify this even more, Is it harder to brake when driving an 18 Wheeler(Semi Truck) or a Honda Civic?

sticks